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狮吹引以为傲的贝蒂狮虎斗,狮子总是杀死老虎!真的是这样吗?

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IP属地:江苏1楼2020-04-18 12:30回复
    3.2.1克莱德·贝蒂
    著名的驯兽师克莱德·比蒂(Clyde Beatty)选了一只比老虎大的狮子取胜,但他在“竞技场”战斗中的回忆却呈现出另一番景象。贝蒂认为,“在尺寸上,狮子通常有一点优势。但是老虎经常拥有更真实的愤怒。狮子有鬃毛,.....狮子在战斗中显示出比老虎更好的姿势,但是说狮子总是可以鞭打老虎是不安全的.....有时老虎会抱住三到四只狮子。并保持笼子不受伤害。” (第187页,参考文献4)。
    所有智能的“越狱”似乎都不是巧合。比蒂提到的马戏团动物,老虎。关于老虎,格雷西说,“格雷西的某些举止对我来说比对逃生本身更感兴趣,例如对她的狡猾。…………这种巧妙地逃脱要求有能力完全愚弄人们。” 他回想起“与格雷西的夜间冒险大同小异的另一次逃生”,那里有16只老虎协同逃生!在另一起事件中,一只名叫Monarch的西伯利亚虎也逃脱了类似的机智。Beatty谈到了聪明的老虎:“我能想到的最精打细算的逃脱是由Big Ross进行的,Big Ross是我曾经处理过的最聪明的老虎。这种动物成功完成的工作要求对前景进行仔细研究,对于可能涉及的每一个步骤,都可能做出松散的决定以及最明智的计划。…………这真是一个了不起的壮举,大罗斯(Big Ross)完美地弄明白了。(参考文献3)。当然,由于害怕黑帮狮子,老虎更需要真正的逃脱,但是它们逃脱的方式背后的智慧令人难以置信。甚至到那时,比蒂从未将这些老虎中的任何一个选为他曾经处理过的最亮的动物。即使他说,“我比以往训练过的任何其他动物,都更快地“拉动” Rajah。他似乎立即知道我要他做什么”(第258页,参考文献3),拉贾不是他训练过的最聪明的动物!据他介绍,他曾经处理过的最明亮的动物是一种叫做金星的母老虎(参考文献27)。具有讽刺意味的是,他最愚蠢的猫也是母老虎,
    比蒂有几个理由被“偏向”狮子。(阅读第3.3.8.8节,可以看到比蒂对狮子的偏爱的明确例子。)在他的所有著作中,他主要谈论狮子,当他谈论狮子时,他也深深地爱着狮子。他已经详细谈论了他的老虎有多聪明,但是除了一只老虎拉贾(Rajah)之外,他从未对它们如此亲切过。比蒂会喜欢他与大多数狮子和拉贾建立的“交流”。他们很顽皮,已经把竞技场当作自己的地方,把表演作为自己的职责。老虎显然没有。由于个人主义,他们甚至试图逃避几次。就像一位母亲一样,比起叛逆的后代,她更喜欢嬉戏但更听话的后代,比蒂总是喜欢狮子和王公。即使是狮子尼禄(Nero)伤了他,他说他是Nero的头号粉丝。顺便说一句,尼禄“拯救”了他免于被一只叫特鲁迪的老虎杀死。[[INDRAJIT.WORDPRESS.COM ]
    为了抵制“老虎女士”马贝尔·史塔克(Mabel Stark)的流行,比蒂最初尝试与一群老虎交手,但显然失败了。后来,比蒂似乎很可能决定在他的表演中既有狮子又有老虎,但狮子比老虎要多得多(关于让狮子成为“竞技场老板”的“设计”,请参见下文)。这就需要传播狮子比老虎更强壮和/或更危险的观点。而且,他的宗教“信仰”不允许他接受老虎比狮子强大的事实。

    Beatty的大多数成年雄狮大约500-550磅,偶尔的“底特律”重约600磅(第45页,参考文献3:“底特律,非洲狮子。英俊,黑鬃,重600磅, )或亨利重350磅的动物。西伯利亚虎约600磅。孟加拉人(看来他的雌性比雄性要多得多)为350到500磅(大罗斯是“五百磅有爪谋杀案”),偶尔还有一些较重的动物,例如拉贾。从其他培训师那里可以看出,比蒂的老虎比其他马戏团的老虎要小。玛贝尔·史塔克(Mabel Stark)老虎“将鳞片的重量从350磅增加到800磅”。Whitey……重850磅”(116页,参考文献55)。罗曼·普罗斯科(Roman Proske)提到至少有一只700磅的孟加拉虎(第259页,参考编号54)。
    Beatty的狮子通常会一起战斗“很快,我在赛场上获得了我所有人的自由,其中包括我的每只狮子和两只老虎(一只老虎正在与几只狮子作战,并设法严重撕裂了狮子的肩膀)”,第74页:“意味着二十只狮子在与九只老虎战斗。”,第75页:“狮子是黑帮,老虎在单独战斗。”,第75页:“一次看起来好像十只狮子在与切斯特(苏门答腊)作战”,第85页:“与此同时,其他老虎跳到地板上,离开了竞技场。渴望追赶并开始战斗的狮子在他们后面。”)这注定要使老虎害怕狮子。就像美洲狮(Puma)或阿穆尔河(Amur)的老虎一样,即使它们可以使猎狗做些短暂的事情,它们也设法逃脱猎狗,但Beatty的老虎却被狮子所占据。
    比蒂承认,这个由狮子统治的竞技场是设计使然的而不是根据动物的自然特征。他提到:“读者,知道我的是老虎行为,可能会怀疑“竞技场老板”是一头狮子,这是否没有证明狮子比老虎优越。在继续讲故事之前,请允许我解释一下我的举止是如此有组织,以至于只有一只狮子可以出现在这个角色中。在进入竞技场之前,我先送来二十只狮子和五只老虎。只有在这短暂的间隔中,当动物在地板上碾磨时,野兽才有可能成为大头目。而且由于狮子的优势,该物种的一员自然会成为统治者。” (第150页,参考文献27)。即使他的六只老虎被狮子杀死,他也允许发生这种情况,这表明Beatty显然希望老虎保持柔和。[INDRAJIT.WORDPRESS.COM/BIGCATS ]
    Beatty在他的一本书中谈到了在狮子与老虎搏斗中可能胜出的可能。牢记上面提到的观点,就可以分析他对虎狮大战的可能结果的看法。
    比蒂说:“在成年的狮子和成年的老虎之间的战斗中,我倾向于对狮子打赌,主要是因为他有一定的身体优势。例如,他的鬃毛可以保护自己的嗓子;老虎没有这种保护。普通狮子也比普通老虎大一点,也重一些。……我不会在同年龄和体重的狮子和老虎打架时疯狂地押注:那是愚蠢的。” (第255页,参考文献27)。这里有一些要注意的地方。首先,比蒂没有赌任何重量相同的动物。其次,他的观点基于他拥有的狮子,它们比老虎重。第三,他认为鬃毛是对狮子的绝对保护。如前所述,对于野生动物,他关于大小和鬃毛的观点可以证明是错误的。他似乎意识到,竞技场的争执不是衡量猫的战斗力的好方法,因为他说:“被囚禁的废料不能提供准确的量度。因为它们的特点通常是情况有利于一方或另一方–由于狮子无法抗拒任何敌人的顽固倾向,因此这一优势通常在狮子的一边。” (第255页,参考文献27)。
    比蒂(Beatty)列举了一些有利于老虎的案例还有一些赞成狮子。顺便说一句,尽管他有很多真正的老虎胜利要谈,但他只能谈论当时的一头狮子苏丹,新的“竞技场首领”,因此一定是最好的狮子战士,他“坚持并鞭打”我的行为中的每只老虎”(第259页,参考文献27)。令人惊讶的是,尽管他设法写下了所有竞技场争斗的细节,但他却在其他任何地方都没有提到苏丹鞭打老虎!此外,他承认这不是典型的案例,但是,他可以举很多只老虎与几只狮子战斗并拥有自己的老虎的例子。例如,“我可以举很多只老虎与一群狮子战斗的例子。实际上,我的苏门答腊虎切斯特打了七只狮子”(第258页,参考文献27),“我不得不承认,很少有老虎能与几只结成一头的狮子在斗争中占据很长的时间,但是我已经看到它经常发生,”(第258页,参考文献27),“流氓他的第三个对手的到来似乎并不畏惧。他四处猛击,以至于眼睛很难跟随他的爪子般闪电般的运动”(第257页,参考文献27),“老虎通常在与另一只动物战斗时处于最佳状态; 通常,另一只动物注定要失败。” (第74页,参考文献27)。比蒂还提到过,他会打赌一个叫罗西的老虎对着一个叫杜克的狮子(被他称为“粗人”)。“像杜克大学一样强大,如果她有两只好眼睛,我会和罗西一起打架,但在残障状态下她无法与狮子匹敌”(第158页,参考文献27)。
    因此,如果Beatty可以得出这样的结论:“狮子老虎的优势问题几乎是个折腾”(第259页,参考文献27),那么看来,即使在Beatty的“竞技场”中,老虎也至少是平等的。甚至在面对巨大的困难之后仍能与狮子抗争。考虑到上述所有要点,克莱德·比蒂(Clyde Beatty)提供了比其他任何人更多的证据,证明老虎在圈养状态下比狮子更好。


    IP属地:江苏2楼2020-04-18 12:30
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      .2.1 Clyde Beatty
      Famous animal trainer Clyde Beatty picked a lion to win if it were bigger in size than the tiger, but his recollections on ‘arena’ fights present a different picture. In Beatty’s opinion, “In size, the lion usually has a slight advantage. But the tiger frequently possesses more genuine fury. Yet the lion has its mane,….. Lion has shown himself somewhat superior to the tiger in fighting, yet it would be not safe to say that the lion can always whip the tiger ….. sometimes the tiger holds off three or four lions and leaves the cage unharmed.” (Page 187, Ref. 4).
      It doesn’t seem a coincidence that all the intelligent ‘prison-breaks’ by the circus animals mentioned by Beatty, are by tigers. About a tigress, Gracie, he mentions, “Certain aspects of Gracie’s behavior interested me more than the escape itself – her cunning, for instance. ……… This cleverly executed escape called for ability to fool people completely.” He recalls “another escape that ranks with Gracie’s nocturnal adventure” where sixteen tigers collaborated to make an escape route! In another incident, a Siberian tiger named Monarch had made a similar intelligent escape. Beatty went on about intelligent tigers: “The most shrewdly calculated escape that I can recall was carried out by Big Ross, the brainiest tiger I’ve ever handled. What this animal succeeded in doing called for a careful study of the prospects, the decision that it was possible to break loose and the cleverest kind of planning for each and every step involved. ……… It was an astonishing feat and Big Ross had figured it out perfectly.” (Ref. 3). Of course, the tigers were in more genuine need to escape, being afraid of the gangster lions, but the intelligence behind the manners in which they escaped, is incredible. And even then Beatty never picked any of these tigers as the brightest animal he has ever handled. And even though he said that, “I ‘seat-broke’ Rajah faster than any other animal I ever trained. He seemed to know immediately what I wanted him to do” (Page 258, Ref. 3), Rajah was not the brightest animal he had trained! According to him, the brightest animal he has ever handled was a tigress called Venus (Ref. 27). Ironically, the stupidest cat he had was also a tigress, Jennifer!
      Beatty had several reasons to be ‘biased’ towards the lions. (Read section 3.3.8.8 to see a definite example of Beatty’s bias towards the lion) In all his books he talks mostly about the lions, and when he talks about them, he does so with a lot of affection. He has talked at length about how intelligent his tigers were, but never sounded so affectionate about them other than for one tiger, Rajah. Beatty would enjoy the ‘communication’ he could establish with most of his lions and with Rajah. They were playful and had accepted the arena as their own place and the performance as their duty. The tigers apparently didn’t. Being individualistic, they even tried to escape several times. Like a mother who’s more affectionate towards the playful but mostly obedient offspring than towards the rebellious one, Beatty always preferred the lions and Rajah. Even though Nero, a lion, had mauled him, he says he was Nero’s number one fan. Incidentally, Nero had ‘rescued’ him from being killed by a tiger called Trudy. [INDRAJIT.WORDPRESS.COM]
      To counter the popularity of the ‘Tiger-Lady’ Mabel Stark, Beatty had initially tried his hands with a group of tigers and had apparently failed. It seems probable that Beatty had thereafter decided to have both lions and tigers in his show but with far more lions than tigers (see below about his ‘design’ to make a lion the “arena boss”). This necessiated propagating the idea that lions are stronger and/or more dangerous than the tigers. Also, his religious ‘faith’ would not allow him to accept the fact that tigers are mightier than the lions.

      Most of Beatty’s adult male lions were around 500-550 lbs, with an occasional ‘Detroit’ weighing around 600 lbs (Page 45, Ref. 3: “Detroit, an African lion. Handsome, black-maned, and weighing six hundred pounds, one of the most enormous animals in my experience.”) or a Henry weighing 350 lbs. The Siberian Tigers were around 600 lbs. Bengals (it seems that he had a lot more females than males) were 350 to 500 lbs (Big Ross was ‘five hundred pounds of clawed murder’) with the occasional heavier ones such as Rajah. That Beatty’s tigers were smaller than other circus tigers is evident from the accounts of other trainers. Mabel Stark had tigers that “tip the scale anywhere from 350 to 800 pounds. Whitey…… weighed 850 pounds” (Page 116, Ref. 55). Roman Proske mentions of at least one Bengal tiger at 700 lbs (Page 259, Ref. 54).
      Beatty’s lions generally fought in group (of two, three or even four), either against another group of lions or against a single tiger (“Lions love to fight in gangs. Tigers, on the other hand, are individualistic.” (Page 116, Ref. 4). Also, “Queenie – a wise and calculating fighter – managed to wriggle free and get away from her assailants, and when the Royal Bengal was gone, Ma’am (Sumatran) found herself with three lions to fight!” (Page 252, Ref. 3). Also, “Down from their pedestals sprang the other lions. Into the tangle they leaped – but not to gang up on the tiger as lions usually do.” (Page 70, Ref. 4). Beatty has made several other such comments that his lions always ganged up against the tigers (Instances from Ref. 27 – Page 68: “Soon I had a free-for-all in the arena involving every one of my lions and two tigers (one was a tigress who was fighting several lions and managed to badly rip the shoulder of a lion)”, Page 74: “This meant that twenty lions were fighting nine tigers”, Page 75: “lions are gangsters, tigers fight alone.”, Page 75: “At one time it looked as if ten lions were battling Chester (Sumatran)”, Page 85: “Meanwhile, the other tigers jumped to the floor, to leave the arena. The lions, ever eager to gang up and start a fight, were after them.”). This was bound to have made the tigers scared of the lions. Like a puma or an Amur tiger that try to escape the hunting dogs even though they can make a short work of the dogs, Beatty’s tigers were dominated by the lions. Even though his Sumatran tiger Chester could fight off seven lions and Sudan could fight off six, the threat was always there.
      Beatty admits that this arena domination by lion was by design rather than by natural traits of the animals. He mentions that, “The reader, knowing that mine is a lion-tiger act, might wonder the “arena boss” is a lion, and whether this doesn’t establish the superiority of the lion over the tiger. Before going on with my story, let me explain that my act is so organized that only a lion can appear in this role. Before I enter the arena, I send in twenty lions and five tigers. Only during this brief interval, when the animals are milling about the floor, is it possible for a beast to establish himself as the big chief; and because of the preponderance of lions it is natural that a member of this species should emerge as the ruling power.” (Page 150, Ref. 27). That he allowed this to happen, even though six of his tigers were killed by lions, shows that Beatty clearly had wanted the tigers to remain subdued. [INDRAJIT.WORDPRESS.COM/BIGCATS]
      Beatty has talked about the likely winner in lion versus tiger fight in one of his books. Keeping in mind his views mentioned above, one can analyze his opinion on the likely outcome of tiger-lion fights.
      Beatty said that, “In a fight between a full-grown lion and a full-grown tiger, I’d be inclined to bet on the lion, largely because he has certain physical advantages. His mane, for instance, protects his throat; the tiger has no such protection. The average lion, also, is a little bigger and heavier than the average tiger. …… I wouldn’t do much frenzied betting on a fight a lion and a tiger of the same age and weight: that would be foolish.” (Page 255, Ref. 27). There are certain points to be noted here. First of all, Beatty didn’t bet on any animal if they were of the same weight. Second, His opinion was based on the lions he had, which were heavier than the tigers. Third, he considered the mane to be a definite protection for the lion. As discussed before, his opinions on sizes and the mane can be proven wrong for wild animals. And he seemed to realize that the arena feuds are not a good measure of fighting abilities of the cats, for he said, “the scraps that take place in captivity do not furnish an accurate gauge. For they are usually characterized by circumstances that give one side or the other the advantage – this advantage generally being on the side of the lions, owing to their incurable tendency to gang up against any foe.” (Page 255, Ref. 27).


      IP属地:江苏3楼2020-04-18 12:33
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        So, if Beatty could conclude that, “the question of lion-tiger superiority is pretty much of a toss-up” (Page 259, Ref. 27), it seems that the tigers, even in Beatty’s ‘arena’ were at least equal to the lions in fighting, even after being against tremendous odds. Considering all the points mentioned above, Clyde Beatty has provided more proofs than anyone else that tigers are better fighters than lions in a captive state.


        IP属地:江苏4楼2020-04-18 12:36
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          狮子在不公平的战斗中杀死了老虎。老虎比狮子强,但脸上充满氨气,因此暂时失去了视力,并被狮子杀死。
          在电影《大笼子》的制作中,这只老虎被狮子杀死。不过,这部分没有显示在电影中。Beatty承认这不是一场公平的战斗,因为他将氨水喷入Bobby的脸(老虎),让凯撒(狮子)摆脱了Bobby的下巴。此外,选择动物必须使狮子获胜,因为那是故事。比蒂说,凯撒是“霸主”。es撒马上要对付三头强壮的狮子(第4章:杀手四级)。另一方面,鲍比的名字从未在其他地方提及。表明它可能不是大老虎之一,也不是好斗士。显然,因此,即使连Bobby也必须通过向Bobby的脸部喷洒氨气来使其抵御600磅的强大凯撒而变得虚弱,它也能说明老虎的战斗技巧(第189页,参考文献4)。即使Beatty坚持认为Bobby还是会被杀死的(他的读者可能会想知道!!而且,也许有人会奇怪为什么当狮子被钉住时他会在Bobby的脸上喷氨,而在老虎被杀死时却在狮子的脸上喷氨!! ),他在其他地方说,如果没有适当的视力,它在打什么障碍(第158页,参考文献27)。比蒂提到了另一起事件,当一只狮子要杀死训练者时,必须使用氨气。如果一个警惕的笼子男孩没有给他一把氨“枪”,那狮可能已经杀死了他。这是一个注射器,如果正确地对准了攻击动物……就会放慢速度,试图屏住呼吸。” (第231页,参考文献3)。罗曼·普罗斯克(Roman Proske)提到另一起事件,由于将氨喷洒在要杀死他的狮子拉索身上,因此可以挽救他的生命(第138页,参考文献54)。在这里可以很容易地看出,氨气如此强大,以至于它迫使狮子不受伤害。显然,如果将氨用于两只猫之间的战斗中,则很可能是决定因素。[[INDRAJIT.WORDPRESS.COM ]


          IP属地:江苏5楼2020-04-18 12:37
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            @艾米维塞尔博士 很抱歉回复晚了。我记得我在一篇谈论狮虎斗的文献里看到过比蒂为了让老虎对狮子产生恐惧而被狮子在公平战斗中杀死,曾经用四只狮子对抗一只老虎。但是目前我没有找到。不想让你等太久,就先把我所找到的资料先发出来吧,免得让你再久等。


            IP属地:江苏7楼2020-04-18 12:46
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              这是一位外国网友的评论翻译版,也提到了这件事。先发出来,仅供参考。


              IP属地:江苏8楼2020-04-18 12:53
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                p的真像


                来自Android客户端13楼2020-05-07 07:30
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                  客观


                  来自Android客户端14楼2020-05-28 19:28
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                    揭秘不够完整


                    IP属地:广东来自Android客户端15楼2020-06-29 17:52
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                      揭秘不够完整


                      IP属地:广东来自Android客户端16楼2020-06-29 17:53
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                        其他两个驯兽师可是告诉我们虎往往战胜狮


                        来自Android客户端17楼2020-08-05 14:52
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                          別傻了


                          来自Android客户端18楼2021-10-30 02:33
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                            到处看到你胡说八道


                            来自Android客户端19楼2021-10-30 08:06
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